Episode 93: Sales-Marketing outsourcing with Jamie Shanks: Focus on What You Love Most
Jamie Shanks
Jamie Shanks is a 3-time agency Founder in the sales & marketing productivity space. 1. Get Levrg - a sales & marketing outsourcing agency that 'buys back' $5/hr tasks from their customers, so they can focus on $500/hr value creation. 2. Pipeline Signals - an Account-based sales enablement certification and Signal Intelligence platform for Account Executives. 3. Sales for Life - the pioneers of Social Selling certifications for the mid-market and global enterprise.
[Sara] Jamie Shanks is a 3-time agency founder in the sales and marketing productivity space. The first business is Get Levrg, a sales and marketing outsourcing agency that buys back five-hour tasks from their customers so they can focus on $500-hour value creation.
The second is Pipeline Signals, an account-based sales enablement certification and signal intelligence platform for account executives. The third business is sales for life. The pioneers of social selling certifications for the mid-market and global enterprise. Jamie, I'm so excited to have you on this show because this show is very heavy on sales and marketing. So welcome to Prospecting on Purpose.
[Jamie] Thank you so much for having me.
Well, and I would love before we get into, um, you know, I want to talk a lot today about this concept of outsourcing talent, because I think it's something people conceptually understand, but maybe in practice and implementation, it's a murky space.
So that's what I want to focus on. But before we get into that, give me a little bit of your origin story. How did you start these businesses? Why sales and marketing? Give us a little background there.
So I'll go back to - I lived in Australia. Did my master's degree there. And when I came home to Toronto, Canada, no one would hire me.
And I thought I had a master's degree. I worked at the Bank of Montreal. I must be a hot commodity. Turns out nothing. Well, it took me 11 months to get a job. And when I finally landed something, it was a 100 percent commissioned commercial real estate job. So, my job was to work with tenants to find office space.
And I called into chief executive officers and chief financial officers. And it turns out I had a knack for it. I was really good at cold calling and booking meetings. Customers loved me. I was personable. And I went from zero to six figures at 25, 26 years old. And I clearly had a knack for it. I then went to a SAAS software company and I was employee three.
And we went from zero to 3 million, took the company to profitability. And I decided to strike out on my own. And when I struck out on my own, I failed miserably. I was a consultant for hire. Yeah, my goal was to help people with inside sales best practices. So this was the emergence of the idea of business development being done digitally through email, through cold calling, through obviously eventually Linked and I got really lucky Almost two years into my failing consultancy I was experimenting with this new emerging tool called LinkedIn And I helped pioneer a category that would be called social selling.
And as I created that category, my sales training curriculum naturally gravitated to the global enterprise. So companies like Microsoft, Oracle, and Intel had thousands of sellers who also wanted to learn tools like LinkedIn. And so I kind of jumped the shark, so to speak. I went from this local small Toronto business to be able to serve Microsoft globally in five supercenters around the world.
And so that was the genesis of getting into being an owner of a professional services firm.
Wow. So let's talk about that for a second because when you're building something that's new, like how did, did Microsoft find you or did you find them?
So there's a concept I taught and I call it, if you've ever seen the movie Back to the Future, Doc Brown slips on the toilet, hits his head on the wall and he invents the flux capacitor that goes into the back of the DeLorean that helps his time travel.
I had one of those moments. When I won my very first customer that I taught was social selling. Here's the quick story. Nobody would hire me. I had this idea that LinkedIn would be pervasive in helping with business development because I had been doing it for myself. I squash every morning with this guy who was the head of customer success at a market research company in Toronto called Vision Critical.
He got me a meeting with the Chief Revenue Officer. His name was Mark Bergen. Mark wouldn't pay me to teach his team because I had no experience. But he decided to make a deal with me. If I helped his sales team, which there was an office in Toronto, Vancouver, London, England, and Australia, by helping them book sales-qualified meetings with LinkedIn, he would give a multi-year agreement to be a reference, no matter who called, even if it was his top competitors.
I took that deal. We booked 31 sales-qualified meetings in 60 days. I think I wrote a blog post about it And then crickets I didn't know what to do next. So here's what I did I grabbed a sheet of paper and I had this moment where I just had this idea I grabbed a sheet of paper and I drew the logo of Vision Critical and I circled it and I asked myself a fundamental question “Who cares?” and when I stared at this logo over and over again I had this epiphany And I started drawing spider webs off of that centered circle. And this was the genesis of a concept I called the sphere of influence. And essentially when you win a net new customer, the only people that care about that case study or story are, as an example, executives that leave that company and go to other businesses or do I dive into the social networks of the very people that exist inside Vision Critical today, who do they know?
And there's a button in LinkedIn that gives you what's called social proximity. You can map the top three to five accounts that people know, then their vendors and suppliers, then their competitors. So this spider web of one customer gives you a map of maybe 5 to 10, or 20 other customers to target. So here's what happened.
Vision Critical won me their competitor, USAMP. USAMP won me a telecom company called XO Communications. XO Communications won me a Taa Communications. Tata Communications won me Thomson Reuters. Thomson Reuters won me Oracle. And that happened in 12 months. So I went from a free deal to a quarter million dollar five-year deal with Oracle in a year.
And that, and then the snowball rolled from there.
Wow. Well, I love that story for many reasons. I love that it started with a game of squash because I feel like that's something people forget. You have a really robust network from your social circles too. And I think that's where People forget that they can ask for favors, they can ask for introductions. If you talk about what you're doing, people remember it. So I think that's very cool. I also love that you did it for free. When I was building my business, I've done a lot of pro bono, you know, events and workshops, but in exchange for things, because when you're building there are other forms of currency. And so you've got the client, you got the case study, you got the testimonial. I think that's so cool. And then to land Oracle in 12 months is awesome.
I always advise new entrepreneurs, whether you're in pro-serve, like myself, running agencies, or you're in SAAS software, to do a few deals free.
Number one, you're going to iron out some of the kinks onboarding and beyond. But number two, you'll, you will accelerate towards product market fit much faster because people will. Naturally just say yes get five or ten deals under your belt so you can get the product market fit faster It's not about zero to one dollar. It's about how you're going to get from one to ten And you will never get beyond one if you can't get anything sold.
Yeah, I had someone, I don't remember who, but I give this advice a lot, too, where I didn't, I wouldn't do anything for free. I would still put together, you know, a loose contract, but just, you know, in exchange for this free workshop, my company, Sara Murray, Inc. will sponsor 100 percent of this in exchange for references, testimonials, etc. So that got me into the habit of talking about money, My fee is X, but for you and this particular event, I'll sponsor it. So it gave me some muscles that I think really helped me early on. And now I'm to a point where another piece of advice that I would get often is to hire a virtual assistant or outsource your talent.
You need help. You can't do it all yourself. And so that's actually where I found GetLeverage. So I am a client of Jamie's and I've been working with the team, um, probably since like February of 2024, I think it's been, it's been like six months now, but I'd love to learn a little bit about how did you make the jump to building out Get Levrg and give us a little bit of background on that company.
Well, there is an interesting story to this as well. So imagine now it's the year 2013 and sales for life start taking off. It goes hyperbolic. Uh, I'm sorry, Jamie, the sales for Life is LinkedIn. The LinkedIn. Yeah, the social got it. Got it Okay, number one So we kind of go whatever you call it hyperbolic/ parabolic in the sense that we start winning We create A sales-qualified lead a day of the global enterprise and we win 600 global customers around the world.
It has me training in 45 different countries and it was a crazy. Problem – So good news is the outside world thinks we're superheroes. We're making every list and we're on the M& A track and people are trying to acquire my company. But I'm also an entrepreneur who's good at one thing I can win business But nobody ever taught me how to read a P & L a profit and loss statement So we're our customers primarily were SAAS software companies.
So they spend Money, they don't have they raise capital they spend money. They don't have and they grow these unicorn-like businesses. Well, I started emulating their growth patterns and I started spending wildly and I woke up one day at the end of 2017 And I was 1 million dollars in debt personally. I didn't even know how this is even possible So I took on some mentors.
I tried to sell the business, I tried to raise capital. I had this big panic, but thankfully I took on some mentors who helped me reframe, the act of growing a professional services firm. And essentially all I ever thought about was the numerator. How do I make more money? Well, what if I saved a dollar?
What does that do? And I'll give you a kind of simple math. You're a 20 percent EBITDA business, 20 percent profit business. Every dollar that you save is actually five dollars. You don't need to go sell to earn the same profit Nobody ever that's the most simple concept in the world. Nobody ever explained it to me. Yeah, now all of a sudden let's use that at a million dollars My marketing spend alone was a one million dollar marketing team If I were to trim a million dollars from marketing spend that is five million dollars of revenue I don't need to go chase. That is dramatic to Reduction of headwind or giving a tailwind to your sales team so long of the short, I go on this journey to start reframing my mindset that I was so fixated that everyone had to come to my physical office.
We had a beautiful office in downtown Toronto Canada Everybody had to come in And now all of a sudden I was more objective and every time we needed somebody for a new role, I would ask myself, do they need to live in Toronto? No. Could they live in Toledo? Sure. Could they live in Taipei? And so all of a sudden my mind unlocked and of course, technology had caught up to allowing people to work from anywhere in the world.
So I started a journey where in the Philippines, India, Brazil, and Serbia, I started acquiring talent, and long the short, a couple of years ago, I was introduced to my now business partner at Get Lvrg Nazmul. We started to recognize that the transformation I went through from being a million dollars in debt to turning around a profit just in one year, I went from loot to the company lost 450, 000 actual on a P& L statement to making 600, 000 the year after, so like a million dollar swing. Wow. Fiscal year I thought there were so many small to mid-market businesses. They're in the exact same scenario They're resource constraints. They don't have the time money or energy to be able to hire here in North America, but they need results So we created a done-for-you agency called Get Levrg and we focus only on sales and marketing my world, Nazmul’s world, my other partner Derek's world and we help buy back the five dollars hour tasks that are bogging down Companies growth And we take those over so that they can focus on $500 an hour value creation.
Wow. And then, how did you and Nazmul meet?
So, very similar where in my, uh, so I ended up starting a second company during COVID. That second company, Was good, but made some serious mistakes called pipeline signals. We invented the idea of monitoring job change alerts on LinkedIn and getting that data into the hands of customers.
So, I can get into its value proposition, but it was the first of its kind and people loved it, but the problem, we were non-technical founders. Trying to jump into a software world. We should have just stayed a pure agency, but long and short, it's called Got Half Pregnant and we were like a tech-enabled service, but long and short, it needed to grow a scaled marketing team.
And we had a marketing team in the Philippines. And they were working, but the Philippines has grown dramatically more expensive, so the labor arbitrage wasn't really there anymore. And one of our teammates, who was doing signal monitoring for our customers, is actually from Dhaka, Bangladesh, and said, I want you to meet this guy named Nazmul, he's like the king of marketing in Dhaka. Got to meet Nazmul. We ended up scaling a team of six marketers and Dhaka inside my company pipeline signals, and that journey began. That's how we met.
Cool. Well, and I obviously met Nazmul too, and he's a wealth of knowledge and it's, it's very cool how you both compliment each other because I know you're based in Toronto and he's based in Dhaka.
I’m the visionary, he’s the integrator.
Got it, Love it. I think one of the things that. Like, I would love to ask you, maybe before we get into some more specifics, to give a basics 101 on like, what does a virtual assistant or an offshore talent, like, do? Like, what's the nutshell version of the story?
Yeah, the nutshell version of the story is they can do any task you can't, shouldn't, uh, and won't. As I mentioned, my silo is sales and marketing, but this could come all the way down to finance. Uh, think of P& L statements, your profit and loss statements, where you have accounts receivables and accounts payables. The simplest way to think about this for your audience is, I'd like you to write down everything you did in one day.
In two columns on a sheet of paper on the left-hand side, It says five dollars an hour task on the right-hand side It says five hundred dollars an hour value creation and I'll use The act of a sales professional as a perfect litmus test for this example. So in sales Sellers are given the role of and I'm putting air quotes now sales go get me sales Well, let's think of what they would need to do today to generate sales in the future.
They need to number one build a list of accounts and contacts in a market They want to go after number two. They need to enrich that database with phone numbers, email addresses, LinkedIn accounts. Number three, they need to build what's called a cadence and a sequence, an orchestration of the stories they're going to tell.
Number four, they need to pick up the phone and run perhaps a call, a call a demo, or a discovery. And so on and so on. We go through this journey all the way through proposal, negotiation, and close. Well, if you separate out the most valuable tasks, those would be demo and discovery and qualification of an opportunity is very skillful.
For those that can qualify a deal in and out, where should we spend our time, account segmentation, and prioritization? That's a 500-an-hour value creation. So is the negotiation of a proposal and building buying committee consensus to close the deal. But all the other things I just described. Uh building a list of accounts, enriching those accounts, getting them into CRM, loading up copy, to do an email campaign pressing play on the email campaign – None of which is a real value creator.
It is a task that generates output for a seller But it's not value creation. And so you remove those things. So to your audience, if you're a founder And in a day you caught yourself trying to collect accounts receivables Or you were asked to pay somebody an account payable or you needed to Think of all of those things that are bogging you down There are others in the world that would happily take that off your plate for a fraction of what you think You Somebody would naturally want to be paid specifically here in North America to do so.
Okay. That was a great breakdown because I, obviously I've been using the company as a business owner, but I think about when I was a salesperson working in corporate, there were so many things that just, I wish I had known. Oh my gosh. Yeah. Like Salesforce killed me all the time, ordering samples, tracking samples, customer, like just, it was the bog down of the minutiae when that wasn't my strength.
And it's like, Oh, had I had knowledge that this was a resource to me? And I, you know, obviously I'd have to make sure the company was okay with it, but I just think I would have even. Performed more than I could have. Gartner's done a measurement of the average seller. I'm, I am a big proponent of this. So sales quota, which is the percentage of sellers that have been making their sales quota has been diminishing for 10 to 15 years.
It's been moving in the wrong direction. Now we used to look at it. Maybe it's a breakdown of their skills and, like their soft skills and capabilities. Maybe they don't have the right technology. I'm now 45 years old and I've been training. Helping founders and sellers sell my whole life, and what I'm recognizing Is that it's actually a time management problem. Gartner finally did studies around this and in an average week, a seller spends half of a day To three-quarters in almost one day.
It's like all-day Friday Trivia to your point, getting things in HubSpot or Salesforce, moving things around, building lists, building reports. None of that is helping your customer. It's just busy work. That's the people to have visibility on the pipeline and what you're doing. And so the teams can brag about each other.
Yeah, it was painful. I lived in Los Angeles too. I'd be driving all day meetings all day. And you get home. I'm like, how do people have children? exhausted. I still have to work all night. It was tough. And I think even in now building my business, that's something that's, you know, mentorship given like outsource these things, outsource these things.
And I, it's like, how do you do that? I think the average person doesn't know how, Oh, let me just call up the Philippines and get somebody to help me. Let me just call it Bangladesh. It's not so black and white and easy. And so I, I actually took courses to figure out how to post. You know, on the online job boards and find someone.
But when I found you, I was referred to you. And when I found Get Levrg, what I really liked about it was I jotted down, I think you made me, jot down all of the tasks that I do and where the skills fit, because I, I think the dream scenario is you find someone who can do all of these different things, but that's not reality.
Nobody's a Swiss army knife. So what I really liked about Get Levrg is you have. A point person, but if that point person doesn't know how to do something, you have experts in all these different spaces. So can you talk a little bit more about like the business model and kind of what is the team structure?
So let's now let's think about your optionality as an owner for talent acquisition, because Here are your options, and I've gone through the whole gauntlet. Step number one, your first instinct is you have a bottleneck, you need a spreadsheet turned into a pivot table. That was the very first thing I needed to solve.
And you go to a place like Upwork or Fiverr, because you need somebody to give tasks, do tasks. Great. So that becomes a great place for single-use projects. Its challenge is you can't then employ somebody long term to be able to do that. And then it's not scalable. It's very cost-prohibitive at scale. So then you move down to a model and Sara, this is where you got into.
And you can. Basically two choices. You can do the fractional talent where you use an agency to give you a halftime equivalent or a full-time equivalent, and they are, say, your dedicated teammate. Now its advantage is it's, it's a natural employment. They are your teammate, but then you are, you succumb to the ebbs and flows of a human being.
Some human beings are great at showing up on time. Some human beings, they don't show up at all and they don't call you for a week or they get sick or the electricity goes out or something happens and you are beholden to the skill of that individual person or their capacity. We've decided we started Get Levrg that way a little bit But we soon recognized that model is great for the global enterprise and global mid-market There are already firms that do that.
Well, they sell half-time and full-time equivalents. The model that works really well for micro SMB, SMB and lower mid-market Is essentially a deliverable or outcome-based model that looks like a triangle. The way that it works is you have a single Point of contact as a project manager. The project manager becomes the best friend of the founder or your internal teammates They are responsible for keeping things on time on budget.
It's done by Friday You don't have to deal with the human dynamics that Sally or Suzy didn't come into the office that day. That's the model that we're building and scaling.
Well, I like it because we'll have meetings where I'll have an idea on something I want to execute, and then it's like, oh, let's pull in the automation boss, he's going to help us here or let's pull in so and so, she's going to help build this landing page.
So, it's been really cool to see it in real-time, and one of the other things that I think is interesting is I truly feel like I have a team that I'm working with, so I want to give a shout-out to Safa and Adiba. They're my teammates that have been, you know, supporting me in the business growth. But I think I'd like to learn a little bit about the dynamic between building out the team from a founder perspective.
How does that work? How are you seeing that kind of percolate now that you've been doing it for a while? So if you were to look at me as a founder, uh, there, and if you almost did like disk analysis or Myers Briggs, and you looked at things that I'm great at and things that I am not, there are two that I would instantly put in the needs improvement pile.
Number one was financial acumen. I think you got that from my first story. And the second was. Human resources or human dynamics. My wife is the president of an ad agency, for example, an experiential marketing agency. So we're both in the agency world and in her office. It's all ping-pong tables and beanbag chairs.
I just, I come, I grew up a farm kid. As I lit, I literally can just plow roads longer and harder than the average bear. And so because of that, I don't need the frills. I don't need any of that. And I struggle to understand why others do. I am learning as a founder that I am a minority and the majority of the world needs culture, atmosphere, and so forth.
I finally see It's actually connected and equal To sales, so our sales team, the sales velocity of all the deals coming through has weekly syncs with HR and talent and think of customer churn the same with employee churn, talent retention. We're monitoring voluntary versus non-voluntary attrition, we do ENPS, we're, we are doing all these initiatives.
Like we now, as an example, our teammates in Bangladesh have their own vacations, so Eid and all the Islamic holidays alongside all the Canadian and American holidays. So, we want to become an employee of choice. In Bangladesh where people give these incredible double vacations that nobody else does. I know I kind of went on a tangent there, but I naturally didn't think of this and so I needed my partner Nazmul who is truly a delivery operations specialist and thinks about the human dynamics in the office We are really over-indexed on HR.
We are actually going to build an internal university, a center of excellence, where we're going to train talent for free, like a university on all the tasks and capabilities that we have. So HubSpot certified, Salesforce certified, how to make videos, how to write newsletters. We're actually going to build this huge talent pool and let them sit on a bench for a month or two and then pick from the talent pool that we've pre-trained before they start.
These aren't things that I think of naturally. So I just want to be open and honest. Oh no, that's so cool. I had to get, I, I needed the yang to my yang in that partnership. Well, it's funny because the guest who's going to be airing right before your episode is a director of talent acquisition At a global company and we talked about the team as basically another revenue stream I think of it as another sales channel and I think about Like where I feel such loyalty to Safa and Adiba is because they have my back.
We are like a true team I think that it's fun to have Teammates in Bangladesh because we make each other laugh a lot the other day, right? You've seen her new here. Have you? Oh, no, I haven't. I have a meeting next week. And I know Adiba is probably by the time this episode airs, she's gonna be out for her wedding.
So we wish you, you know, very happy nuptials. But one of the things that's just so funny is we just make each other laugh. The other day I was saying, just scooch this up a little bit, like on a web page. I'm like, just scooch this. So now we know what the word scooch is, but we teach each other stuff.
And it's been really fun. I would like to get some best practices from you on if somebody is thinking about outsourcing talent, what are some of like the mindset shifts? Because I know for me. You think about like, Oh, I'm the only one who can do this, or I have the vision, or I'm the one that has to talk to the customer.
So how can people kind of overcome some of those mindset shifts when they're going through this transition? That's great, and I'm so glad that you said mindset shift. So I created when I launched Get Levrg, I actually created a course and we still train customers on offshoring best practices. And the first module is called Mindset because it all begins there.
Here's. Let's actually break it down. There's really the outcome you're trying to drive towards is you have to be able to defend your why you're doing this to stakeholders. Those stakeholders are going to be internal employees. We're going to question your decisions They're going to be customers prospects vendors and so forth.
Maybe your own investors So you have to think backward from the fact that you're going to be questioned on this Now, you probably want two answers. There'll be a qualitative answer and a quantitative answer. The quantitative answer is really obvious. You're most likely doing this because of the labor arbitrage.
But you have to be able to game theory out what are you going to do with those new retained earnings as an example. That's the reason you're doing this, is you're doing this because it creates Financial optionality, and that optionality allows you to redeploy those profits to launch a new product buy a second company Maybe finally normalize your salary so your family can live happily and healthy Maybe you are trying to build up retained earnings to insulate for a future recession So there has to be you have to be able to look people in the eyes and say I'm doing this financially because it's the best thing for the corporation One of the best things that was ever told to me is that a corporation, the entity, Get Levrg Inc.
Incorporated, is that an Inc. is a living, breathing, or living, breathing organism, and if it could think and talk for you, it has an opinion, and its opinion is to grow and grow financially responsibly, so it would not care that you have teammates in Toronto or Toledo or Taipei, it just wants great talent for great output.
And so it justifiably would absolutely thumbs up the idea of you mean We're going to get somebody to do social media management for one-fifth the price your corporation would scream. Yes, So that's the quantitative the qualitative, and the best way to sell this internally at least this is What I told myself to justify it is your existing onshore teammates.
This isn't about role replacement unless there is a vacancy in the role. I have never fired somebody in North America to then rehire offshore. This has been where there's a capacity gap or bottleneck or somebody left a role and now we needed to fill it. But what I tell the onshore teammates is that my biggest concern is your, is the retention of you as talent, you got hired and you probably all had these big dreams of working on these strategic initiatives and projects, but life got in the way, we don't have the resources, so I threw like 17 things at you, and now you're stuck doing all these tasks you hate, and I can see that you hate it.
And inevitably, it's going to clip your wings and you're going to leave my business because you're going to look for greater pastures. So I want to remove those bottlenecks from you so that you can work on the 500 an hour value creation and have more fun in the business. That's, so you have to have that story.
I love that. And I, there's a couple of companies and business owners that I follow, and every single one of every single person on the team has their own virtual assistant. And that's something that the owner chooses to give to them because they see the pain of the tasks that they don't wanna do or that bog them down from strategic thinking and bigger projects and more fun, creative projects.
And I think that you can still do those. With your teammates overseas. And I think that it just makes it more fun, more enjoyable. There's someone to share in with the results. So I think it's really fun. I think it's very clever and brilliant the way you have the company structured. Is there, you know, before we wrap up, is there any other, thing I didn't ask that you would want to make sure that we, we leave the audience with?
No, I think that what's important for anybody who has not gone from zero to one or one to many with offshore talent is really look yourself in the mirror and ask, are you happy with your current situation, whether it's financially or you might have talent retention issues on shore. There are ways to solve this.
And to your point, there are thousands and thousands and thousands of small to medium business owners that have now successfully scaled in our case, sales and marketing talent to, um, to be able to do things in go to market that they frankly had not been able to do before. Right. Okay. I love that. And I like the idea of just self-reflection and kind of the idea of What would the company want.
Because I've never thought about it from that angle. And I think that it does give us a helpful framework for decision-making because everything you say yes to, you say no to something else. You want to make sure you're saying yes to the right things. And for me, I see where my personal bandwidth is where my business is going, and how much busy is coming my way, which is a beautiful problem.
But I feel so grateful that I have the infrastructure of the team. So that when busy hits, I'm not hating my business. You know, it's been, it's still enjoyable and I still have support. So I want to thank you for being on the show. I want to thank you for your mentorship. Thank you to Nazmul as well. Like you've been a really nice partner and, I see why you're successful in sales.
It's, it's, it's a pleasure to work together.
Thank you so much.
Watch the episode here
Connect with Jamie
Jamie Shanks, CEO of Get Levrg and Pipeline Signals, specializes in optimizing offshoring for profit growth. With a background in leading “Sales for Life”, he’s trained 250,000+ professionals globally for industry giants like Microsoft and Oracle.
YouTube: www.youtube.com/@getlevrg
Instagram: instagram.com/getlevrg
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jamestshanks/
Connect with Sara
YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@saramurraysales
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/saramurraysales/
Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/saramurraysales/
